View Full Version : SPOILER - pv v dogboy

05-05-2003, 09:31
This is the thread for my PBEM 1 v 1 ladder game against dogboy. Dogboy, if you have slipped in here by accident - bugger off immediately.

The game started on 26 March.

I'm Persian, dogboy is China, and AI is Arabs, Romans, Celts and Mongols. Monarch, not a very big map.

05-05-2003, 10:34

Not quite start as that file seems to have disappeared. Very nice to see a cow (and for once im gonna resist putting the cow link in - if you havent seen it go to Fall of Rome Spoiler - its a hoot).

Researching iron working first, not for an early victory (cos I suspect china will be too far away as this is a constructed map) but so I can see where it is as early as poss to expand in the right direction. Also cos Ive never got IW from a hut but hope to get Pottery (extreme wishful thinking is often at the core of my strategy). This may cost me in terms of early expansion.

Goody hut to SE produced barbars; much consternation, worker hides, warrior out scouting scurries back. Survived at cost of missed a few worker turns. (Re-played this bit to get a screenshot and the hut popped a settler - well blow me down I thought what a shame that didnt happen).

05-05-2003, 12:07
1990 BC

world map
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/200355105831_Persia world map 1990 bc.JPG

local map
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/20035510593_Persia local map 1990 BC.JPG

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/2003551105_Persia score 1990 bc.JPG

At this point I had met everybody and knew where they all were with the exception of dogboy. Had found some more cows and now had a settler factory established. Just as well this is only Monarch because at this point my score was only marginally better than the truly awful Celts. I was researching literature - though god knows why. A few turns later I decided that the strategy was to research Monarchy and attack with my immortals to generate a Monarchy Golden Age.

The worker, whose feet you can see at the top, is heading towards the iron in the hills just to the north of him.

05-05-2003, 12:51
490 BC
Map (There is more of China to the right of this, most of the light blue here was Celtic not long ago)
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/200355113829_Persia 490 BC.JPG
Score (This shows the destruction (almost) of the Celts (dark green) by dogboy's Chinese (light blue)). (It also looks like Persia is getting bigger but it is not, we have all moved along a bit to accommodate China!)
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/200355113913_Persia 490 bc score.JPG

I have got a nice shaped empire though dogboy's is really odd. Dogboy had all but wiped out the Celts, and they had had an enforced palace jump to their town to the south east of Persia. This put my town in the south, which was there for the furs, under pressure from cultural conversion, whereas before the palace jump I was hoping it would work the other way.

In the isthmus between the two bits of the Arabian empire (Pink) dogboy had followed up by sticking 2 towns on grapes and incense - just before I did so, the bugger!

Researching Monarchy - due to arrive in 6. I was very tempted to join in smashing up the Celts but stuck to my strategy of waiting for Monarchy Golden Age. This attack would now have to be against the Arabs. Luckily in a few turns time the message was broadcast that the Arabs had built the Oracle in Mecca.

05-05-2003, 13:04
110 AD

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/200355112950_Persia 110 AD world map.JPG


http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/20035511309_Persia 110 AD score.JPG

Culture (No need for this to be here really but I just like the shape)

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/200355113032_Persia 110 AD culture.JPG

At 110 AD my Golden Age ended. During it I had annexed large chunks of Arabia including the Oracle at Mecca and had got a couple of techs and a couple of towns for the Peace Treaty.

Nearly all my towns now had temples and libraries, and the ones in the middle of the empire had marketplaces.

I sent my immortals off towards the Mongols.

05-05-2003, 13:35
310 AD

Halfway to Mongolia my immortals changed their minds and decided to attack the Romans. This made military sense as clearly the Romans did not have iron and therefore it was a good idea to attack before they got legionnaires. Elites used to attack in an attempt to get a GL (in vain so far). Also may be last chance to use immortal attack as pikemen are appearing on the scene.

I have got Engineering, Dogboy and the Mongols have got Chivalry, nobody else has got either of these. The Mongols have got a few medieval infantry. The Mongols will swap all their money and Chivalry for Engineering. I am currently building some horses before this swap to upgrade. (I have got 1600 gold).

My plan, since the invasion of Rome was going so well, and there was still empty land in the northeast corner of the world, was to start heading towards a domination victory. However, although my army is clearly strong enough to take the Romans apart and can probably do the same to the Mongols, if all my troops are in the west and northwest I might have a load of Chinese horsies/Riders galloping almost unopposed into my eastern provinces. I have just had the following conversations with Chairman Dogboy:

chairman dogboy
if i recall correctly we agreed to have a peace deal until 500 AD, with a review at 300. I think both our interests are best assured to keep our peace treaty in place.

your horsies are acting like they are embedded - I hope they are enjoying the view.

[There are Chinese horsies watching the destruction of Rome by the gallant Persian immortals]

Prince Xerxes,
You do recall correctly. I have no intention of breaking our peace deal, in fact, I might ask you to extend it once we reach 500AD. My horsies are simply there to watch the fall of the Roman empire. However, I have begun moving them back.

Chairman Dogboy
Presumably your horsies are on the way back to be converted into riders.

I am, of course, glad that we are going to continue down our peaceful path. However, some of my cabinet are becoming concerned at the news of your construction of Sun Tzu's Academy because they find this difficult to reconcile with your peaceful proposals.

Would you care to enlighten your ally,

Prince prettyvacant.
My horses are on the way back to my land so that they will not end up in your land when you finish conquering the Romans. I have no desire to disband them so I am moving them back now. As for why I'm building Sun Tzu's Academy, it is because I'm a peaceful person. The AI is less inclined to wage war on the nation that holds that great wonder.

So I have been trying to get a GL to either build Sun Tzu to stop dogboy and of course for my own benefit, or to build a FP somewhere.

The question is:

Is dogboy going to build Sun Tzu, churn out a 100 Riders and smash me up, so I better send a load of defenders pronto to the east, (I am researching at max towards Gunpowder, I will have it about the same time as he gets Sun Tzu) or

shall I believe him and concentrate my forces on attacking Romans and Mongols, and churn out some more Settlers to populate the northeast of the world with Persians?

05-05-2003, 13:49
Entertaining story !! Keep up the good work.

05-05-2003, 14:05
Thank you Aggie. However, when I say the question is?? - I really am looking for people's opinions as I haven't got a flipping clue! I was going to set a poll up but can't.[confused]

05-05-2003, 14:30
I'm at work now, but when I'm at home and have more time I will try to answer a question or two.

05-05-2003, 14:32
What happened to Persepolis? I see Pasergadea is the Capital...

05-05-2003, 16:14
quote:Originally posted by ERIKK

What happened to Persepolis? I see Pasergadea is the Capital...


a. Silly - What do you call a deer with no eyes?

b. Pretentious - "Persepolis of course was what the greeks called the capital of persia, or Parsa, and i wanted to call my capital what Darius would have called it"

c. Aggressive - some bastard stole my capital!!

d. Over confident - I decided to give dogboy a start by destroying my own capital.

06-05-2003, 11:27
Good story

Its hard to see the layout of the land. maybe a screen shot of the border will help.

What about the f3 screen, or does enemy miltary not show until you can plant spies?

06-05-2003, 21:05
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/prettyvacant/200356203717_border2 350 AD.jpg

Damn this is a big pic - if this causes problems loading
the page let me know and Ill delete it.

This shows the border where the main attack might come,
if he wants to strike at the heart of my empire (he might
be sneaky of course).

F3 shows I have strong military at the moment. My point is
he will or could switch all production to Riders when he gets
SunTzu and soon be in a v strong position.

One thing has occured to me: he said he's building it so the
AI is less likely to attack. Balls - romans, celts and arabs
are no threat at all, and the mongols, who are not much better
would have to send their army through me (hmm perhaps something
could be arranged).

06-05-2003, 21:42
Yeah, the best defense is offence.

If he has any brains he is planning to build an army as soon as he has SunTzu's. I guess you should get barracks built everywhere and build your own army...

06-05-2003, 21:53
What difficulty is this game on?

06-05-2003, 22:09
I've got quite a few barracks already, and these are now making horses to turn into knights and pikemen to turn into musketeers. Anything other than riders and I would feel confident in seeing them off. Yes I am sure the the answer is big, strong defence and let him batter his horses against my guns (I am assuming I have got saltpeter somewhere).

I am sure I said - Monarch. And frankly that is a bit of a nuisance as the AI is not very good at researching and there is not much trading going on (especially now that the Celts, Romans and Arabs have been so sadly depleted).

14-05-2003, 19:42

My beautiful bell.

(OT - is it true that the new Man City ground is gonna have a stand named after the wonderful Colin Bell, and thus the fans there will be known as the bell-enders?)

QUESTION: I've ended up with a load of culture more or less by accident but i was hoping that i might gain the odd conversion here or there. However in 4470 years - nothing.

What else should I do to help achieve conversions, and is it worth the effort?

14-05-2003, 19:49
quote:Originally posted by ERIKK

What happened to Persepolis? I see Pasergadea is the Capital...

I started a game as US the other day, moved my settler one square, and when I built my first town it was New York rather than Washington. Does moving change the name of your capital to the next town on the list - sometimes?

15-05-2003, 01:48
quote:What else should I do to help achieve conversions, and is it worth the effort?
Try using this to check the probability of flipping an opponent:

Flip Calc - Calculates the probability of culture flips (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=53157)

10-06-2003, 21:51
Fearing the worst due to the approach of Sun Tzu I reopen talks about extending the peace:

Pretty vacant: to my chinese friends we are approaching the end of our peace treaty. As a peace loving nation the Persians would like to extend this major contribution to> the good of the world. I am sure you agree. Please let me know your current thinking.

Dogboy:I also would like to extend our peace treaty. I see no reason to be a warring nation and would like to continue to be your friend until 1000AD.

Pretty vacant: great, agreed - got any bargains?

Dogboy: Not really, I don't have any techs you don't have. I have 2 lux you don't have if you are interested in a trade for those.

Pretty vacant: sorry, turned down yr kind offer of gems. Not needed at the moment in persia a bargain means for example you offer me gems, i offer you one gold. This is not a concept that has caught on in China yet then?

Much relief in Persia, we love the prettyvacant day celebrated throughout the land! The spectre of hordes of Riders galloping through our homeland recedes. Unlike some Civ 3 players, who I will not name here, I do believe that when Dogboy says we have got a peace treaty he is less likely to attack.

10-06-2003, 22:03
Realise just how right I was to get a peace treaty when I received the next piece of information.

Dogboy It's funny how two games can be so different. It just turned 700AD and I don't have cavalry yet. In a 1v1 game I just finished with Maverick, I got military tradition in 610AD and upgrade all my mounted warriors to cavalry. I attacked Maverick in 660AD, and utterly crush him by 880AD, a mere 20 turns. That game I was very aggressive attacking everybody with my mounted warriors and getting good peace deals, that may be the difference.

pretty vacant: : one of the "problems" I have found in this game has been that the AIs are so weak they have rarely if ever got any science to swap or extort. aslo i think you and I have been resarching the same things - therefore between us all little (comparitive) scientific progress

10-06-2003, 22:08
A few days later (real time) I was chatting on MSN when Leo’s was built in Persia, my plan, I proudly announced, was to get as many knights as possible and upgrade to cavalry as I was zooming along in Chemistry.

Within 10 minutes Dogboy had sent me this message What do you need that wonder for? Doing a mass upgrade to cavalry or something?

[As it happens of course it wasn't too difficult for him to spot my strategy as he had used it himself in the recent past and had told me he had done so!]

Prettyvacant: various defenders to muskets actually - ive been keeping the non muskets hidden from you (afaik!)

Dogboy: I know you have a pretty big military, my advisor tells me so. Mass upgrades to musketman all over will only make you that much stronger. Hmm, and you have been at war with the Mongols for several turns now. You sure are a big warmonger!

I sure am!! I have been wiping out all the other Civs as quick as I can whilst keeping my fingers crossed that Dogboy is as honourable as I think he is.

10-06-2003, 22:50

We have peace treaty to 1000 AD. In what I believe is the spirit of our game, I intend to stick to that. I will get mil trad about 8 turns before 1000. The plan is to continue to land grab, including wiping out the other remaining tiny civs (which gets kinda tricky with auto respawn), but leave one so I can use Darius to build cavalry army, win a battle with it, build Military Academy (which is currently being prebuilt under Palace), turn off science as soon as I get Mil Trad, use money to upgrade my gazillions of Knights and finish off libraries in all my new towns (thus increasing chance of dom victory). I will also have a few settlers ready to fill in behind cavalry - if all goes well. If he is foolish enough to let me have a few "useless" towns ill probably win on dom before he thinks hes actually losing!

Last message from dogboy received today: "I got the save, but I can't play it. The moving truck is packed and I'm logging on to my e-mail through another computer. I will have the save when I get back, whenever I get back. Hopefully we can finish this game then because this is a close game in my opinion. Later :)"

In case you dont know, he has gone to Afghanistan, for up to a year. My current ladder strategy is simply not to lose, while those above me do so!! Last time I looked I was up to a completely undeserved third.

11-06-2003, 09:35
"Darius". if that is not enough incentive for the chinese riders then what is

11-06-2003, 14:23
When you press 'B' to build your city, and than press esc or press the x to not settle and than the next time you press 'B', it skips over the city name that you didnt use.