CDZ Cup 4th Edition sign-up and discussion thread - Page 3

socralynnek · 29-11-2004, 11:14

I also want to check-in.
(Coming from CFC)

Name: socralynnek
Team: Grasshoppers Elm
Germany

Post team ID as well please. Grasshoppers Elm (524416)

yndy · 30-11-2004, 15:17

18 teams so far and 3 days to go. It looks like it will be a 3 X 6 schedule with 3 groups and 5 matches in each group which will leave room for only 2 knock-out rounds.

Still if we get more joiners in the last minute we'll change that to 4 X 5 schedule which has the advantage of 3 knock-out rounds but also games between teams from different groups which add to the complexity of the schedule.

We still have the options of 3 X 7 and 4 X 6 as back-up but probably it will not be the case.

Schip · 30-11-2004, 16:46

Yes, well I don't really care what the format will be. I would however advocate to start the next edition sooner in the season, so that we can have a bigger cup. I understand that people are still playing their national cups, but after about for weeks that'll be over for most of us. Others that want to join but are still in their national cup could flow in later (just like in the Dutch KNVB cup). Just my 2 cents.

PS I'm really looking forward to the 4th edition!

Shabbaman · 30-11-2004, 17:12

Who's still playing cup matches then?

Kemal · 30-11-2004, 17:38

If the number of participants keeps growing per edition like has been the case up to now, Schip's idea seems like a good one to me, there will probably be not many people playing in the national cups for too long, and if we don't start early, arranging the later stages of the cup becomes more and more difficult.
It is disappointing if the amount of participants will lead to a decrease in knockout matches, though I do understand the reasoning behind it. Hopefully there will be a possibility of more groups, allowing for more matches to be played after the group stages, as I think those are just more fun to play.

Melifluous · 30-11-2004, 19:04

So how about instead of 3 x 6teams.

6 lots of 3 teams, playing both the other members in each group home and away?

Then the winners of each group plus the 2 highest 2nd placers go though to the 3 rounds of knockout?

Or course I'm not so sure about how Yndy was going to deal with the not quite winners (I dont like the word loser) of the groups before, but he can do the same with these after?

Would be the same number of matches I think...

My 2 cents, this is a discussion thread right?

Melifluous

Schip · 30-11-2004, 22:37

@Shabbaman: Nobody I think. In fact I meant that most of us (if not all) haven't been playing cupmatches for 3 to 4 weeks now. That's why I would like to start next edition a few weeks earlier. And i would still like to include the stronger teams that stay in their cup for 4+ rounds. So we need a solution for that (as they do with championsleague teams ending in 3th place in the first round going to UEFA cup)

@all: I personally really liked the 3th CDZ cup setup where everybody could play untill the end. I think we should keep it that way, which means a 'semi-' knockout phase (losing teams play eachother)

yndy · 01-12-2004, 09:52

Re: starting sooner: The idea behind starting late is to have the last match in between seasons so that we can all play our best teams. But it's not like it 'has' to be like that. With the increase in the number of players we could start in week 5 next season which would allow us to play up to 10 rounds of matches. However, I think we shouldn't extend the duration of the Cup too much, but I agree we need more flexibility.

Re: playing until the end: I think this is a key idea in this Cup, everybody plays until the end in every edition of the cup. I'm not thinking of changing that.

Re: league matches vs. knock out: I think the best solution is to balance them and it's true that 5 vs. 2 is not balanced.

@Meli: 6X3 will takes 9 weeks with league games home and away and 6 weeks with only one game in the week. And yes, this is a discussion thread.

Shabbaman · 01-12-2004, 10:27

We could start earlier next season, but with "weeks off" between them. That way you can postpone a match if someone is still playing "real" cup matches, or just to play a friendly v.s. someone else.

While we're at it, why don't we come up with a seeding system? Like (proposal) the highest playing teams (calculated from the lowest league, not the highest (for instance, meli and I both play in the 6th, but that's englands lowest league (paupers) and the dutch 3rd from lowest) are placed first and are "group heads", and then the second highest and so on and so on. The seeding system we used last time split in winners, previous cup players and newbies. Also nice, but not really objective.

yndy · 01-12-2004, 11:20

OK, on the seeding idea, but don't expect it to be very objective either as teams like Meli's, Boots', english_brit's and Hakon's will have a lower seed only because their leagues did not expanded fast after they have joined.

I've prepared the list and added the joindate as a second criteria and the results are:

48.25KB

29-11-2004, 11:14	#21
socralynnek Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USS Defiant Posts: 3,827	I also want to check-in. (Coming from CFC) Name: socralynnek Team: Grasshoppers Elm Germany Post team ID as well please. Grasshoppers Elm (524416) __________________ Being without a signature since November 2004.

30-11-2004, 15:17	#22
yndy Prince Join Date: May 2003 Location: Romania. Posts: 895	18 teams so far and 3 days to go. It looks like it will be a 3 X 6 schedule with 3 groups and 5 matches in each group which will leave room for only 2 knock-out rounds. Still if we get more joiners in the last minute we'll change that to 4 X 5 schedule which has the advantage of 3 knock-out rounds but also games between teams from different groups which add to the complexity of the schedule. We still have the options of 3 X 7 and 4 X 6 as back-up but probably it will not be the case. __________________ The one and only

30-11-2004, 17:12	#24
Shabbaman Administrator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Costa La Haya Posts: 8,493	Who's still playing cup matches then? __________________ "Our spam is backed with COMETS!"

30-11-2004, 17:38	#25
Kemal Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Netherlands. Posts: 3,108	If the number of participants keeps growing per edition like has been the case up to now, Schip's idea seems like a good one to me, there will probably be not many people playing in the national cups for too long, and if we don't start early, arranging the later stages of the cup becomes more and more difficult. It is disappointing if the amount of participants will lead to a decrease in knockout matches, though I do understand the reasoning behind it. Hopefully there will be a possibility of more groups, allowing for more matches to be played after the group stages, as I think those are just more fun to play. __________________ <b>\"In the Game of Thrones, you win or you die\" </b>

30-11-2004, 19:04	#26
Melifluous Administrator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: In the bar with SF. Posts: 3,024	So how about instead of 3 x 6teams. 6 lots of 3 teams, playing both the other members in each group home and away? Then the winners of each group plus the 2 highest 2nd placers go though to the 3 rounds of knockout? Or course I'm not so sure about how Yndy was going to deal with the not quite winners (I dont like the word loser) of the groups before, but he can do the same with these after? Would be the same number of matches I think... My 2 cents, this is a discussion thread right? Melifluous __________________ Isn't it awfully nice to have a penis? Isn't it frightfully good to have a dong? It's swell to have a stiffy, It's divine to own a dick. From the tiniest little tadger To the world's biggest prick! So three cheers for your willy or John Thomas. Hooray for your one-eyed trousers snake.

30-11-2004, 16:46	#23
Schip Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Netherlands. Posts: 289	Yes, well I don't really care what the format will be. I would however advocate to start the next edition sooner in the season, so that we can have a bigger cup. I understand that people are still playing their national cups, but after about for weeks that'll be over for most of us. Others that want to join but are still in their national cup could flow in later (just like in the Dutch KNVB cup). Just my 2 cents. PS I'm really looking forward to the 4th edition!

30-11-2004, 22:37	#27
Schip Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Netherlands. Posts: 289	@Shabbaman: Nobody I think. In fact I meant that most of us (if not all) haven't been playing cupmatches for 3 to 4 weeks now. That's why I would like to start next edition a few weeks earlier. And i would still like to include the stronger teams that stay in their cup for 4+ rounds. So we need a solution for that (as they do with championsleague teams ending in 3th place in the first round going to UEFA cup) @all: I personally really liked the 3th CDZ cup setup where everybody could play untill the end. I think we should keep it that way, which means a 'semi-' knockout phase (losing teams play eachother)

01-12-2004, 09:52	#28
yndy Prince Join Date: May 2003 Location: Romania. Posts: 895	Re: starting sooner: The idea behind starting late is to have the last match in between seasons so that we can all play our best teams. But it's not like it 'has' to be like that. With the increase in the number of players we could start in week 5 next season which would allow us to play up to 10 rounds of matches. However, I think we shouldn't extend the duration of the Cup too much, but I agree we need more flexibility. Re: playing until the end: I think this is a key idea in this Cup, everybody plays until the end in every edition of the cup. I'm not thinking of changing that. Re: league matches vs. knock out: I think the best solution is to balance them and it's true that 5 vs. 2 is not balanced. @Meli: 6X3 will takes 9 weeks with league games home and away and 6 weeks with only one game in the week. And yes, this is a discussion thread. __________________ The one and only

01-12-2004, 10:27	#29
Shabbaman Administrator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Costa La Haya Posts: 8,493	We could start earlier next season, but with "weeks off" between them. That way you can postpone a match if someone is still playing "real" cup matches, or just to play a friendly v.s. someone else. While we're at it, why don't we come up with a seeding system? Like (proposal) the highest playing teams (calculated from the lowest league, not the highest (for instance, meli and I both play in the 6th, but that's englands lowest league (paupers) and the dutch 3rd from lowest) are placed first and are "group heads", and then the second highest and so on and so on. The seeding system we used last time split in winners, previous cup players and newbies. Also nice, but not really objective. __________________ "Our spam is backed with COMETS!"

01-12-2004, 11:20	#30
yndy Prince Join Date: May 2003 Location: Romania. Posts: 895	OK, on the seeding idea, but don't expect it to be very objective either as teams like Meli's, Boots', english_brit's and Hakon's will have a lower seed only because their leagues did not expanded fast after they have joined. I've prepared the list and added the joindate as a second criteria and the results are: 48.25KB __________________ The one and only