Civ Duel Zone  

Go Back   Civ Duel Zone > PBEM and Pitboss Games > Archived fora > SilentConfusion's Confusing Spam
Home

 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-04-2010, 06:55   #11
akots
Nebuchadnezzar II
 
akots's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Glover Park
Posts: 4,459
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentConfusion View Post
... I can put a city back where I started. I will try to find someone early and take their capitol. I think the tile 1SE of the plains hill is either horse or a metal. ...
You cannot seriously count on that. I mean finding somebody rapidly. Map should have a lot of empty space. That is easier to find and archipelago map is good for rexing and you have cheap courthouses. If going for a war, you have to do it very-very early and then, maintenance will kill your research. Also, you won't get tech superiority unless the guy is a complete newbie. Your research will be quite slow at least for the first 50 turns. Slower than most of the players.

You might have horse or metal but gambling on this might not be the right thing. It can as well be empty. So, making a mistake is one thing but persisting with this mistake is another mistake IMO. That's what Ciceron said some time ago.

But again, you never know how it will turn out. May be your decision is not logical or experience-based but it could be a lucky move and you still will be doing OK. Ever won a lottery? I never did so am trying to rationalize things. Simon won a few times probably. He always pops something good from huts and gets that wonder when built simultaneously on the same turn with somebody else.
__________________
Cujusvis hominis est errare; nullius, nisi insipientis in errore perseverare
Ciceron (Marcus Tullius)
akots is offline  
Old 12-04-2010, 11:10   #12
socralynnek
Moderator
 
socralynnek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: USS Defiant
Posts: 3,827
Default

It all depends on which players you are playing against. But normally you can expect in a pitboss to have some neighbor which is kind of aggressive, especially if the neighbor sees that you don't have much defense.

Seems like some more people have moved instead of settling, so others might have the same roblems as you have.

I don't know whether moving the Settler again is worth it, but I am no expert in capital city placement anyway.

Settling in place might be alright. I guess, at some point you need a city on the island with ivory, whether you use the ivory in your capital or not.
__________________
Being without a signature since November 2004.
socralynnek is offline  
Old 12-04-2010, 12:17   #13
Robi D
King
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Adelaide, Australia.
Posts: 2,060
Default

I'm joining in on the conversation late so akots and BCLG have covered what i would have said so i'll add only a couple of thoughts

First with Archi map production is at a preimium given the discontinuity of the land which leaves coast/sea tiles in just about every cities BFC. And in MP games production is the most important resource so settling on a plains hill is a waste of hammers, which you wont have a lot of on an Archi map.

As for moving the settler (which you already have) i have a hard and fast rule to settle on the spot unless i can see that moving would be beneficial. The reason for this is i have never seen the map scripting place a settler on a spot that the BFC would be bad, it's above average at worst (although everything outside the BFC might be a giant icy wasteland) and secondly moving blindly means you can end up no better or ever worse off. You can end up paying for a bad gamble for the rest of the game.
__________________
"I'm altering the deal, prey I don't alter it further" Darth Vader

"We shall defend what is ours.
We shall never surrender" --Kosovo is Serbia!
Robi D is offline  
Old 12-04-2010, 12:42   #14
BCLG100
Deity
 
BCLG100's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Lahndan
Posts: 6,220
Default

It's up to you, you can settle here and try and swap your capitals early with a GE (forge GP I rarely bother with early wonders and with a hammer less start would be quite a challenge). Personally, due to the time spent moving backwards and forwards I would just settle here and be done with it, chop out that second settler asap and plant it in the original starting location/if you find somewhere better.
__________________
the sooner you fall behind, the more time you\'ll have to catch up!

CDZ Cup Champion!!!
BCLG100 is offline  
Old 12-04-2010, 17:00   #15
SilentConfusion
Chieftain
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 18
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robi D View Post
(although everything outside the BFC might be a giant icy wasteland)
This wouldn't really happen, would it?


And once again, I appreciate you guys taking the time to help me learn.
SilentConfusion is offline  
Old 12-04-2010, 18:57   #16
Robi D
King
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Adelaide, Australia.
Posts: 2,060
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentConfusion View Post
This wouldn't really happen, would it?
Only if your name is Robi and your civ is Byzantine
__________________
"I'm altering the deal, prey I don't alter it further" Darth Vader

"We shall defend what is ours.
We shall never surrender" --Kosovo is Serbia!
Robi D is offline  
Old 13-04-2010, 08:27   #17
SilentConfusion
Chieftain
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 18
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robi D View Post
Only if your name is Robi and your civ is Byzantine
I guess I'm safe then.
SilentConfusion is offline  
Old 28-04-2010, 10:42   #18
SilentConfusion
Chieftain
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 18
Default

Alright guys. We're back with more. The game was down and then paused for a while so you didn't miss much.

I decided to settle in place rather than moving, although I realized my mistake. In this instance I decided to stick with my current position, even though akots correctly pointed out that to persist in a mistake is an even greater mistake. My plan was to chop/whip a settler quickly getting one out as quickly as possible to put it back where I started. I'll have to make up for my bad capitol with quantity. To move back and settle there would pretty much mean I would get only one semi-good city on my island. This way I get this Fish site (which isn't that great) and a city farther south with grass river forests.

Here's what it looked like when I settled on the plains hill:



I started building a Fast Worker to chop a settler, the fast worker would get the EXP boost with the first border pop. My warrior explored the rest of my island. On t=5 my neighbor popped their borders (I guess they didn't wander before settling):



This is very close. I think we're going to transition into the take someone else's capitol mode. Looks like it's going to be Gandhi of Russia's capitol. Guess I'll need some Fishing and some Sailing after BW. If I get copper (which would be absolutely great) I'll be able to put two axes onto their continent with a galley.

My warrior finishes exploring the island after having found way too much desert and not enough food. He is able to spawnbust the whole island on t=9 (only 4 turns after barbs were able to appear. This means any barbs that spawn are more likely to be on my opponent's islands if they aren't properly spawnbusted. Here it is:



With a galley I could drop two troops two tiles from their capitol without having been seen. Without copper the best I can send is archers, but that requires another tech. Without copper I will have to have more than two troops, which means either waves of two troops at a time or more than one galley. Four warriors would probably be enough. Substitute in some archers and it would definitely be enough. People don't like to rush for archery, so the best I'd be facing is probably 2 warriors. Any spawnbusting troops he has that are more than two tiles from the capitol won't get there in time. I'll know if they have slavery by then and they will whip another warrior most likely. In the picture it probably makes more sense to land on the forest for defense.



So the current wish list is two galleys and four troops to invade, with perhaps some more for a second wave. With demo-work I might be able to tell if Russia builds a lot of warriors.

The questions I have to ask myself:
-Is a barracks a good idea or a waste of hammers? I'm thinking with galley-space limited I'll want them to have promotions, but not sure if a second wave would be more helpful than promoted units.
-Are archers likely to be needed? I am thinking I'll want to attack before getting archery so it will be warriors or axes (fingers crossed).
-How do i micro my poor land to get all those troops faster? Obviously with forest chops, but what about a work boat after sailing for the fish to fuel growth for whipping? I'll have to count how many hammers I'll have and see what I need to build and match resources with needs.

Here's an overview of my island with resource bubbles on. Notice all the desert and the lack of food resources (no seafood anywhere except the fish in the capitol). I think much of the riverside grassland will have to be farmed.

SilentConfusion is offline  
Old 28-04-2010, 11:09   #19
socralynnek
Moderator
 
socralynnek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: USS Defiant
Posts: 3,827
Default

I think, you should get a Work Boat as soon as possible after BW. It will greatly help rusing.
Gandhi idn't start with mining, right? So the chances that he has some good efense soon are slim.

But if you don't get Copper, it might be difficult. So, let's see agan in 7 turns...
__________________
Being without a signature since November 2004.
socralynnek is offline  
Old 28-04-2010, 12:54   #20
BCLG100
Deity
 
BCLG100's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Lahndan
Posts: 6,220
Default

You can always put two axes on the ivory and move them one tile north east at the same time you land the other two axes and save having to build a second galley. He might be able to spot them though so i'm not sure.
__________________
the sooner you fall behind, the more time you\'ll have to catch up!

CDZ Cup Champion!!!
BCLG100 is offline  
 

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 20:42.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.