****Whomp's Spoiler 18 Person Pitboss game****
 

It's about time I posted a thread on this game. I'm playing Elizabeth of the English. I hope to get to some redcoats since they are very solid units.

This could turn out to be a very fun game. I'm currently between 3-5th in score if that means anything. Things have progressed pretty well so far. I'm on the end of the pangea so I have no one to my south other than some barbs that will need to be taken care of. I was one of the first to alphabet and luckily popped a hut for metal casing and I'm currently researching machinery. Trading has been hot and heavy. The economy is moving along nicely, including trade routes with the only AI Egypt. I also have some nice resources in my borders and more within range.

I have an alliance with Robi_D(greeks). Robi is a good MP player and I wanted a strong partner. We have exchanged all of our techs and he's met nearly everyone. I sent him metal casing and told him to hold off until we can get a solid trade. He is to my NW and we are both backed up by water. His research of maths will be finished in 5 turns and we've discussed having him research either construction or currency. BCLG(aztecs) may be added as a third partner and would research towards CoL or currency. We've also discussed trading some units as time goes on.

We have some very good players in this game including some CDZers Matrix and grs. grs is at war with the host daveshack. I've considered sending a warrior towards grs and pillaging his iron while he's busy with daveshack. daveshack is the host of the game so we can't have him get knocked out too early. I don't want to help any of these strong players like kuningas, davemcw and the fellow CDZers.

Here's a view of Whomper Room...
I changed to settler since there's iron that BCLG told me about to my north near the floodplains
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...40_whomper.JPG
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And the empire....
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...ity screen.JPG
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Here's a view from the satelite. I will try to make some lines with the feature that allows me to do that later.
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...5_sat view.JPG
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Here's the current tech picture. I have a nice tech lead right now. Machinery is actually due in 14-16
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...ech screen.JPG
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Picked up a few more techs including HBR from Robi. The only techs I'm missing are the religious techs which are controlled by grs, matrix and I think RegentMan. I have a feeling DaveMcW just finished the Oracle sling since he went from lower third in score to #1 2 points ahead of me. I have received some coordinates from Robi D on the whereabout of some that I have not met. This includes grs, tubby and robboo. We still don't know where a few others are including Theoden, DaveMcW, Regentman, Sigma and a couple others. I believe they would be north of Matrix.

Speaking of Matrix it sounds like he's got Meleager and Robi looking to gang up on him. Since I'm in tight with Robi and strategically with BCLG and Meleager I may jump on the pile. We need the religion! We still have a considerable tech lead that I think will widen even further after I finish machinery, Robi finishes maths and BCLG CoL.

Here's a view...

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...10_borders.JPG
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Things have become very interesting the last couple of turns as Matrix is being attacked by Robi D, Meleager and Robboo. Not looking good for poor Matrix since Robi is #1 in power and Meleager has praetorians. Looks like the Jewish capital is under siege.

It seems some of the big players are being sent a message since GeorgeOP attacked Kuningas today as well. I think I'll keep my friends close and be happy I have water to my back.

This makes me happy. Commerce seems to be to civ4 what growth was to civ3.

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...nfo screen.JPG
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With the #1 GNP in the game the tech lead continues since I just got machinery in. Most players don't even have metal casting yet. Grs just got it but self researched. Robi has some deals working for currency, monarchy and construction without trading metal casting. We decided the best thing to do is attempt theocracy. Cross your fingers we become Christians. Worst case we get a good civic.

Time to work on the military for a bit since Trumpton will finish the library in 2 and Whomper Room just finished a settler and knocking out 2 turn archers (upgrade to crossbows will be coming with iron). THe settler is headed towards the iron NE of Trumpton and will get some sheep too.

Where to settle next? I think if I head west I can fill in the south later.

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...world view.JPG
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I would go north and west.

In your situation, my goal would be to get up 5 cities and turtle up till Redcoats.

A short conversation with Mauer today. He seems concerned and I guess he should since I'm up HBR, metal casing and machinery. It sounds like the deal for construction fell through as DaveMcW wanted machinery from Robi D. Not happening. Robi will finish his research on drama and head to CS so we can start on maces. We will most definitely be the first to maces I'd think.

I was thinking the next 3 cities would be west to connect Robi and cutoff my south. I may let the barbarians build a city to my south since I will undoubtedly have superior units and will use them for promos and city builders. From there it will be north towards the empty spaces. With redcoats I could be very dangerous so getting there is the key. Fully protecting the cities will be the order of the day.

BTW I'm feeling a little neglected since Tubby is already on page 2 of his spoiler. Are his that much cooler? [hmm] Tell me what you'd like to see since your wish is my command.

Well, you are trying to outspam Tubby? [confused] That is a competition you (or anyone for that be) cannot hope to win imho. [lol]

Heh I think Tubby is a much better spammer than I. What I'm hoping for is some thoughts from some of the superior players at CDZ. There are some high quality players in this game and it would be a thrill to win this thing. I have a feeling with 18 people it could come down to a space race and I'd like to prepare for that victory condition.

If I were in your position, there are a few things I would work on.
1) Cities. Get to 5 of them really quickly
2) Military. Having a few X-bows and Maces around prevent someone from overrunning you quickly.
3) Get some LB's up. LB's with City Defense are dang near invicible until way later, or tons of suicide cats.
4) Make plans to take out a neighbor in ~ 75-80 turns. Nothing helps show that you are serious like kicking some dude in the junk.

OK here's an update since last time. I will have pictures up this evening.

I researched theo and it seems I have Christianty in the bag since no one founded it last turn and I'm finished this turn. I plan to spread the word in my two major cities.

From there I plan to go into anarchy and focus on military, settlers and workers and keep developing with my financial trait. The iron should be hooked up in 3 which will allow me to make crossbows. The horses are hooked up for Horse archers but I can build war elephants instead since Robi and I traded silver for ivory. Robi should have CS in 12ish so Maces are coming soon.

I will have a lib in Whomper Room in 3 and Trumpton has a lib and is training a settler so things are going well on the science and economic front. I plan to head towards some wines and sheep (pigs maybe). This settlement will solidify my western border and from there I can settle some furs to my south.

In other developments, it looks like Matrix is going down for the count today. He sent Theoden 2 workers which was a nice gift. Davemcw has declared on Saladin (one of 2 AI) and Regentman. He's already captured Stonehenge so things don't look too good for Regentman. I haven't heard what's happening to Kuningas' war with Tubby and GeorgeOP.

Recent intelligence says grs and davemcw are partnering up since they've been trading techs amongst themselves and probably realize they are marked people in this game. The good news is they are both up north of me. I have a feeling this is going to become a north versus south type game.
grs has refused my open borders offer so my warrior will have to head west through Hattie instead. grs is up monarchy on me.

Grs and DaveMcW have become major targets. DaveMcW is in the process of eliminating Regentman and will likely do the same to Saladin. Most players think Theoden will be next. It's shaping up as a north versus south game. Here are a few pm's that have been exchanged. I am currently in theocracy and building all military units so I'm preparing for some war.

Davemcw and grs are exploding off the charts right now since they are #1 and #2 in most of the top categories.


http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...30919_demo.JPG
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Here's a current map....

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...230943_map.JPG
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The current state of affairs...

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...02653_fore.JPG
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Well Whomp, you only have one choice here. You need to declare war and get 1 or more of your buddies involved in it as well. You don't have to do anything persay, just declare, move a unit or 2 that way and sound really pompous.

This will score major points with all those around you.

OK here's a world map of the game. There is an enormous amount of support being built to gang up on davemcw (Mongolia brown), davemcw's vassal Regentman (gray) and grs (India purple). There are about 8 of us who are boycotting them and plan to make war soon.
Davemcw and grs don't have maps yet so this is new technology. I just closed my borders with Davemcw and grs never opened them so he doesn't have a lot of information about me.

I'm England (white) in the lower right hand corner.



http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...304813_pit.JPG
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Hi Whomp, I had to register just to say Woo Hoo!, you took the barb city!

The evil tyrant DaveMcW has been busy.

Welcome Furiey!!
Yes the evil tyrant is about to upgrade all his keshiks to knights too. There's are two menaces to the north without a doubt. Plans for their demise are coming together.

Someone else is about to get culture bombed by Rome since he just finished music. It seems BCLG just took Shackopolis and only lost 2 cats in the process. It's unfortunate that our host for pitboss may be toast.

I'm sending some units to Hattie for promo opportunties with Robi D. If I see grs on the battlefield I will declare on him. I have 4 elephants and crossbow on the way. Running 100% military right now and I'm about 4 turns from guilds.

just post a new map!

I see from the pitboss thread at CFC that Robi_D is now at war with grs and DaveMcW. Does that mean that the N/S war is starting? How goes it with you?

Davemcw and grs will soon be at war with everyone.

I am stacking outside of BCLG's Aloha city (I can't move into the city yet since it's hindu like grs) and my plan is to raze grs' capital. I'm waiting for the catapults to arrive and will have a stack of 4 War elephants, 3 knights, 1 crossbow and 3-5 cats. I was going to use the terrain for safety but I'm also considering moving along the fast route blitz style via the rice paddies with the knights for the element of surprise.....on this I am conflicted.

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...411_attack.JPG
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good luck

OK war is officially on versus grs, davemcw and dave's minnion/vassal state Regentman. Our side has Robi D, Mauer and myself. I anticipate BCLG and all of the southwestern part of the map to join in. Here's a mini preview of Heliopolis. I have another stack headed right for grs' capital.

Helio
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...2757_helio.JPG
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and a world view...


http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...world view.JPG
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Current status of the war effort.
grs' cities...
Thebes and Heliopolis have been captured plus Bangalore and Madras have been razed. Dehli's under siege.
Davemcw
New Sarai has been razed. I believe that was Machu Pichu.

Surrender proposal from Davemcw. He's lost considerable units on his border.

Pretty tempting for me considering I'm on the opposite end of the planet from him. I may have to accept with my partner's approval. Robi D (NW greenish color, Mauer flesh color and Meleager purple) are my long term partners. BCLG (lime green) is the one who should be concerned. He's going to have to play nice with us.

If you don't have many units there that would make any significant difference to the war (or what you have aren't needed), it may be a way to get some more gpt without causing problems for your allies, of course it would have to be with their agreement or it would not bode well for the future. Such a deal could be to the benefit of all your partners.

That's what I'm thinking Furiey. We've done our job crushing grs and now some of us can get some cash from davemcw.

Update ?

OK I'll have one up tonight. It's been way too long and the field has narrowed. I have an outside chance at this one but need some breaks to win.

OK here's the current situation. A early partnership with the west (Robboo, Sigma, Tubby and GeorgeOP) along with the east consisting of Robi D, Mauer, BCLG and myself was put on versus Davemcw and grs. grs was eliminated with the largest benefit going to BCLG. Davemcw held off the incursion from the west and they bailed out on us and made peace. We had a tech agreement with them that we felt they bailed out on as well. This caused a second war where Robi D and I hit GeorgeOP and Tubby (who just taken out Sigma). Robboo jumped on the pile and like a vulture took Tubby's backside.Luckily, I took 5 cities in a space of 7 turns and that's why you see two cores. Maintainence has been an issue.

Another war started recently where Meleager declared on Robboo. Robi D had a defensive pact with Robboo so he declared on him. Meleager out of frustration declared war on Mauer since Mauer had sold units to Robboo. This activated a defensive pact with BCLG into the game. Mel is down to one city. This has caused major issues for me since I was receiving considerable resources from Mel. Here's a big view map...
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up..._world map.JPG
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It has reduced my chances of success signifcantly. The big question remains what is Davemcw planning? He still doesn't have industrialism so no aluminum and no Apollo. BCLG and I have a permanent peace and he's beating me on space parts. We are the only one's to finish Apollo. Here's the pictures of the victory conditions and my cities.
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...1212659_vc.JPG
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http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...517_cities.JPG
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Wow, this is close but I dont see how you can gain on BLCG who is quite in front of you in space parts...
Good luck.

what SS techs are left Whomp? and does BC have them?

I need BCLG and Davemcw to go to war. Maybe Robi will start something. :D

Well there's a new problem. Davemcw just got fiber optics and will most likely build the internet giving him free techs when two of us learn the tech. My spy is headed his way to try and unhook his aluminum but depending on how many copper sources he has maybe I'll use it for the copper to slow internet.

BCLG is ahead on ecology and unfortunately is running 4 turn research. Mel's demise took a fairly large chunk out of my economy because of his vast lux and food resources. Most of these are in Robi's hands with some going to Robboo and BCLG. Mauer got one city.

I still need ecology (life support), robotics (docking bay), fiber optics (cockpit) and genetics (stassis chamber) and fusion (engine). I am currently researching fusion since the engine is 1600 hammers and the capital should be able to crank that out pretty quick with the ironworks though I may build it in Trumpton since the capital can build spies. BCLG doesn't have Scotland Yard built.

I'm considering changing civics to representation for science and :). I'm in univ. sufferage now and can't rush space parts. Bureaurcracy could help gold and hammers in the capital. My trade routes are generating more than my maintainence and Konjic is finishing a court so that will help. State property would lower my maintainence but I'd lose a trade route from free market. I'm a bit conflicted on that one because of the anarchy.

This game was a blast whether I win or lose. One of my biggest mistakes was parntering with my two neighbors Robi D and Mauer. I've talked to Mauer about this and he agreed I should've taken him out earlier. As you can see having the land up to Loveshack would've been huge for me. Lesson learned.

Yeah I've learned that I suck supremely at diplo. [lol]

The move with withholding the techs earlier was necessary and in my opinion wasn't going against any deal. It just sucked for you guys... much like me losing my land sucked for me.

What about nuclear weapons?

no one has built the Manhatten project and I doubt that Whomp has the resources to waste on it.

I've thought about nukes but honestly they seem less effective than spies (which I can produce in 1 turn). Destroying critical resources (copper and alum) is the key in either case but with spies I have a chance to get away with it. If I'm caught, fine. Bring your stack from one end of the map to the other. This also assumes my allies won't close their borders or join me in the fight.

Can spies screw up his production (ie, destroy hammers)? Maybe find out which cities are building the parts and then attack it with spies. Should be pretty funny, especially if he can't figure out whose doing it and you can blame Dave :)

Here's a few pictures. I can sabotage Dave's production with low probability. Here's a picture of the first city I've entered.
Here's my question to the lurkers. I've offered permanent peace to BCLG. Would sabotaging BCLG be considered an act of war? I want to do the honorable thing but we didn't discuss sabotage when we said we'd go permanent peace. There was an initial offer of alliance(peace, no spies etc) with BCLG, Mel, Robi, Mauer and I but Mel and Mauer denied this deal. Do the probabilities of success increase the longer your spy is in the city?

Here's a look into Dave's first city...

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...8_davemcw2.JPG
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Here's a view of his key resources. He does not know industrialism so the aluminum hasn't been revealed.

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...11_davemcw.JPG
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Here's a view of BCLG's resources....

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...33051_bclg.JPG
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I would say no.. Russia and the US were in a state of peace during the Cold War, but spies were rampant if you believe the old Cloak and Dagger movie

I haven't done much with spies in CIV. In C3, if your spy failed, it was an act of war iirc

I would venture a guess that Dave's plan is to declare on BCLG to disrupt his ship, then build his own, counting on you to not be able to beat him. Your use of spies is educational; how does it calculate the probability of success? I need to get in on one of these pitboss games, looks like a lot of excitement and intrigue!

Well I tried to find out about espionage missions in civ4 but couldn't find too much. It seems the probabilities increase if the resource is not protected by units. This aluminum resource was not protected so I presume the odds increased to 90%. It will be interesting to see if Davemcw notices.
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/up...72823_alum.JPG
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I'm tempted to turn down research (for missions) and knock out my four spies. Three for Davemcw and one for Simon. What do you think?

Oh one more thing....I put units on my resources. :D