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View Full Version : Erik vs JM, spoiler thread


jack merchant
25-08-2003, 14:50
So puwen has something to do at work [:p]

Here is my core at turn 170 or so (FP is in Osaka)

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/2003825134926_EJ_lands.jpg

Fortunately, I've so far been able to avoid having a GA - I hope to trigger one by the time we move to the next age.

jack merchant
25-08-2003, 14:54
And here's the diplomatic situation at turn 170 (war with China below as well as with the Ottomans):

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/200382513521_EJ_diplo170.jpg

And the minimap:

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/2003825135344_EJ_map170.jpg

jack merchant
25-08-2003, 15:00
Notice the ROP I had with my allies the Babylonians ? Two turns later, it's gone, and so is the alliance. The Chinese have been destroyed by my new best friends the Ottomans:

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/200382513567_EJ_diplo171.jpg

And the map changed a bit too:

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/200382513581_EJ_map172.jpg

The RoP came in handy.... but I wasn't evil enough to use it for complete destruction of the Babs.

Just for good measure by the way, I made sure the Ottomans gained knowledge of Military Tradition and Sipahi too ! [fdevil]

jack merchant
25-08-2003, 15:28
In case anyone was wondering, those alliances had a good 14 turns left to run..... but my rep was shot anyway because of a weird occurrence earlier in the game, so blackening it a bit more should have no further adverse effects.

Puwen
25-08-2003, 16:07
Thanx for the pictures, oh that is sooo evil [fdevil]

I did about the same thing in my game vs Plux to the Persians.
But in that game reputation doesnt matter since there is no AI to talk about anymore.

jack merchant
30-08-2003, 13:01
Turn 198: The Carthaginians sneakattack ! They fail to take any cities though, and leave me a nice little present:

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/200383011570_EJ_GAkey.jpg

At this point I'm Electricity and Medicine ahead of Erik, though he likely has Nationalism. I'm researching Sci Meth, but factories should be available soon, so this:

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/200383012056_EJ_GA.jpg

comes in very handy indeed !

jack merchant
30-08-2003, 13:07
Mysteriously, by the way, no-one wants to ally with me against the Carthaginians. I wonder why [crazyeye]

Aggie
30-08-2003, 13:59
Great moment to get a GA! Good luck [hammer]

Skyfish
30-08-2003, 17:37
Very well done Jack !
Real good !
You now need a plan to destroy Erik, you dont want to let him get to Tanks right ?

jack merchant
31-08-2003, 14:03
Turn 203:

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/200383113220_EJ_ToE.jpg
42.68KB

I now lead Erik by Medicine, Electricity, Sci Meth and of course AT and Electronics - at this pace, I might get to tanks before him !
The best idea seems to me to be to kill the AIs with cav, infantry and arty, then get to tanks before Erik does. With this tech lead, that might just be feasible.

Skyfish
31-08-2003, 14:07
that means he is building factories everywhere so watch out ! Start prebuilds for those now !

jack merchant
31-08-2003, 17:25
Turn 209: I research Industrialization only to discover I'm the first to that too [eek]. Erik got Electricity and Medicine after some trading but since he *was* researching ( albeit at half speed), I can only assume he researched either of those.
Sadly, the Otto's got Industry right after I got it (from tech devaluation I suspect) so I can't get a boost from it in relation to Erik. OTOH, I did remember to get factory prebuilds in place 4 turns in advance thanks to Sky's advice [goodjob].
Next up is Rep Parts, due in 6 at a small deficit. I'll build mostly rifles and cannon next few turns to prepare (I traded Sci Meth for Nationalism and gold from the AIs).

Skyfish
31-08-2003, 22:59
Nice move on the factories ! :D
It really seems he got slowed big time by his wars, you have to take advantage of it to the max and build a long term plan on how to trample him [hammer]
Now what about Hoover ? Have you got a prebuild going on ? Have you got Iron Works ?

jack merchant
01-09-2003, 01:39
I suspect I am safe for Hoover - it's due in 5 IIRC from where I am now (in an IW city). Erik only just got factories, for which he traded with rep parts (I was researching it too, him selling it around shaved a turn off).
There is a dark cloud on the horizon though..... I may not be able to keep up the tech pace after my GA ends, and I only lead Erik by AT and electronics now (next up - the Corporation - or should I have gone for sanitation instead ?).

Skyfish
01-09-2003, 10:15
Those 2 techs (At and Electronics) can net you most, if not all of the lower half of the IA tech tree if you can trade well... You should not be afraid to trail at one point letting the AIs and Erikk search the lower/middle half, while you spend time searching Radio and other top half techs, then once they've researched what you need you can trade...
But whats' the plan Stan ? You need to focus your efforts here...

jack merchant
03-09-2003, 22:02
Hm, the plan was to bash a path through Carthage and Ottomania towards Erik, but that turned out to be a grievous mistake. Sending out that Inf/Arty stack without proper backup was stupid; I should just have kicked some Babylonian ass, then take out Carthage.

On the bright side, I'm not too scared of the AI (except for the Sipahi), and Erik so far does not seem to have an exceptionally powerful military. However, I went for Sanitation after the Corporation when I should just have moved on towards tanks; there is enough lousy terrain that killing infantry is a royal pain and with two towns within striking range of Erik, I need to split up my defensive forces too (map later).

What I'm going to do now is soak up the pressure, keep on researching and once the AIs are ready to talk, turn them on Erik in the peace treaty (which means that I'll be back at war the moment he makes peace, but by that time I should be able to deal with them more forcefully).

jack merchant
04-09-2003, 22:25
Well, the AIs have been bought off (at turn 228 or so) at no cost. In fact, my run at sanitation did turn out to be useful - it netted me espionage, refining and communism (which might come in handy for a few cities). Erik asked for peace but I saw no reason to give it to him - he doesn't have espionage yet so as long as we stay at war he can't steal. At turn 230, I'm 4 turns away from the Intelligence Agency and running 100% taxes for +700gpt - I'll probably be able to steal Steel at this rate if Erik keeps researching.

If I'm really lucky, he might even forget that AT and Electronics are required techs for Mass Production and Tanks ! :D. This still gives me a crucial two-tech lead. The problem is that the AIs couldn't be turned back on Erik even in the peace treaty, so I'll have to deal with all of them myself......

jack merchant
05-09-2003, 01:09
Turn 233, and my income has risen to about +820gpt now, with Wall Street due in 3 or 4 turns. This should give me enough of a buffer to research MP and MT at a deficit after getting Steel (somehow).

My current military is strong enough to hold off the AI should they show up again, and Erik hasn't made any agressive moves. Having learned from my earlier mistake, I'll bring the war to Babylon when I'm ready, then deal with the other AIs later. Hopefully I can accomplish this in the timeframe before Panzer.

Aggie
05-09-2003, 08:25
Indeed, profit from your strength! At this moment you make a great amount of money and you have a tech lead. Your plan sounds good.

jack merchant
06-09-2003, 17:02
On turn 236 (having purposely waited two turns after the construction of the IA), I managed to plant a spy in Berlin - and I like the military comparison screen :

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/2003961627_EJ_armies.jpg
57.27KB

jack merchant
07-09-2003, 22:10
Turn 248: The AI are out to get me:
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/20039721735_EJ_front1.jpg
75.43KB

and so is Erik:

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/20039721822_EJ_front2.jpg
22.96KB

I didn't bother trying to count exactly how many units he has there.

I just researched combustion (and got there ahead of Erik, who wised up and researched AT and Electronics before going for the other techs) so there's two techs left to go - it will take me about 15 turns to get tanks though, I suspect :(.

In other news, I captured Babylon and Sun Tzu, saving about 25gpt on upkeep. Should come in handy.

jack merchant
13-09-2003, 21:16
A tip to everyone who tries to do research in PBEMs - don't lower your science rate at the last turn of research - it just might tip off your opponent that it makes sense to steal again :D.

In game terms, this means that I got Mass Production the second Erik researched it himself ! I'm now going to research tanks on my own, which will take 6 turns. I noticed Erik has been building transports, which probably means he's going to try and attack me from the Babylonian lands to my north. After killing about 50 of his units in an infantry/artillery stack that got cut off before being able to retreat to safe territory over the course of the last 3-4 turns, I will now change my focus and kill off the Babs so he can't attack me from there. with about 100 artillery and 30 cavalry, this should take no more than 2-3 turns.

Aggie
13-09-2003, 21:19
Exactly the way I do it usually ;)

jack merchant
17-09-2003, 13:45
We both got Motorized Transportation on the same turn, through research this time (I would have gotten it one turn later than Erik due to tech devaluation). The Carthaginians and Ottomans have Radio, but attempts to steal it have failed. What's worse, I'd assumed Erik would get it and stole carefully twice on turn 262 (the first time failed but the spy got away) only to find out we were even in tech still ! That about 5k down the tubes there [cry].

Moreover, Erik's Panzers are doing the business on the Ottomans, helped by some agressive setttling:

http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/2003917124110_EJ_agressive.jpg
42.69KB
(I'll try and get him to agree not to do this vs me).

It's also becoming ever clearer that the RoP-abuse of the Babs was a serious mistake - since I can't RoP with the Carts now nor ally with them, there's no way I can go after Erik without beating up the Carts.
Which was planned anyway, but I didn't take into account the fact that Erik might ally with the Carts vs the Otto's (he told me that he needed the alliances for rops [confused]). So now a good number of my troops are in Cart territory and poised to strike, and I'll just have to wait and seee what he does to them....... :(.

Finally, an amusing diplo shot from an attempt to extort Hannibal for Radio:
http://www.civ3duelzone.com/forum/uploaded/jack merchant/200391712453_EJ_froggy.jpg
40.85KB

Aggie
17-09-2003, 13:51
quote:Originally posted by jack merchant


Moreover, Erik's Panzers are doing the business on the Ottomans, helped by some agressive setttling:

(I'll try and get him to agree not to do this vs me).


I assume that it's a bit too late to ask that. This is a perfectly good strategy, not to be confused with settler creep.