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ERIKK
11-03-2003, 16:22
I wish I could make a poll a couple of days ago when I had the chance to backstab anarres while he just attacked the Ottomans!

Should I have done it?

ERIKK
11-03-2003, 16:26
In my logs I have written down my thoughts on this matter btw!



ps;
Hey , I am a moderator over here ;)

Melifluous
11-03-2003, 16:34
Not even a question.

You should have stabbed him in the back and won the game when it was easiest. I suspect Col and I really cant see any reason why you did not.

Melifluous

You [:o)]

ERIKK
11-03-2003, 16:55
quote:Originally posted by Melifluous

Not even a question.
You should have stabbed him in the back and won the game when it was easiest. I suspect Col and I really cant see any reason why you did not.Well, the reason is in the logs... If I did it no new peacedeal will ever be trusted again (between us).

Melifluous
11-03-2003, 17:00
I understand that between you two that is an issue, but personally the idea of this sort of grudge taking seems odd, but hey been said before...
And by more intelligent people than I.

Melifluous

col
11-03-2003, 17:34
quote:Originally posted by Melifluous

And by more intelligent people than I.

Melifluous


hehe not necessarily.

I do think that you worry about reputation too much here Erikk. Most neutral players would judge that if you stabbed Anarres at this moment, you made a strategic decision to go for the win at that moment. Breaking a treaty is not a reason to not do it. If Anarres is being objective then he will recognise that you are not only entitled to go for the win but that trust is not an absolute thing but based on the game situation at the time. I know we've been here before but I think by playing this way, you are showing an exploitable weakness.

On the other hand, you may judge that the damage to your production of a war would worsen your chances of pulling further ahead in tech and production and that staying out of war brings you closer to the win - and this may well be the best view.

It is clear that the space race favours you and that Anarres must go for the dom win. He must attack you at some stage. You do not NEED to attack him. I dont know how attack and defence in Civ3 will prove to be balanced. Will a very large force (250+) of MA and radar artillery and nukes overwhelm the strongest defence or is it possible to set up and impregnable defence?

We shall see. Looking forward to a large modern war.

ERIKK
11-03-2003, 17:43
Well, i was weak at that moment, 45 tanks + 55 infantry or so. While anarres has twice as much units. Staying in defense seemed wiser too.

This turn 252, I will have computers and will upgrade all infantry. From that point on I can draft whenever I want to. My cities are all big (20+) with a few entertainers.

Anarres is denying me luxiouries but I already had thought of that and all my cities have temples and colloseums (in the later game you build them in 1 or 2 turns!) Now I can draft the entertainers.

I think anarres is researching towards MA. He will have it earlier than me but I am not sure if he will attack at that moment (pre 265), certainly not now I haven't done it to him. I will have MA before 265. Right now I am prebuilding RC's in all big cities and thus have them in 253. That will kickstart research and cash can be used for other things from that point on.

col
11-03-2003, 20:15
That makes sense - better to let Anarres think it was some moral reaon rather than a lack of firepower ;)

I wouldnt trust Anarres to not attack you becasue you didnt attack him. He doesnt think that way. He will attack when he thinke he has the best chance of succeeding imo. The window between you having MA and Anarres having MA will be a dnagerous time.

Mm - Anarres hit the AI with 200+ tanks. If he'd hit you it would have been game over!

Sir Nukealot
11-03-2003, 20:36
Just a thought, if the Ottomans aren't dead yet, you could gift them a city and win by the UN-vote.

If they allready are dead, then go for the stars.

ERIKK
11-03-2003, 20:44
quote:Originally posted by Sir Nukealot

Just a thought, if the Ottomans aren't dead yet, you could gift them a city and win by the UN-vote.

If they allready are dead, then go for the stars.
That we have a great risk! They really hate me. I cannot do anything good the last ten turns. I would have to research Fission which will get me out of the MA window! I count on a defensive war and in which I can last long enough to launch my spaceship!

col
11-03-2003, 21:44
Yeah - but they must hate Anarres more. I guess they'd abstain in any vote now.
Time to pillage your own railroads to clear a DMZ across the chokepoint at least three moves wide!

ERIKK
11-03-2003, 22:25
He he :)

I have already done that! The entire area has no roads anymore. But a Chinese settler has already been spotted.... He is going to build against my cultural border!

col
12-03-2003, 00:18
yeah - I guess Anarres would have to do that. Have you read Moonsinger's thread about artillery, workers and settlers to move aggressively forward. If he has enough workers he could fill in all the rails in his turn thn use settlers to allow full movement.

I think setting up the defense will be harder than the attack. How many armies have you got? Artillery?

The problem is that Anarres doesnt have to conquer you, he just has to damage your research and production capacity enough to allow his reinforcments to overwhelm you.

How many tiles of yours will Anarres need to get domination?

ERIKK
12-03-2003, 09:50
In turn 253 I will have (single untis):
10 research centers ;)
50 mech inf's
30 inf's
40 tanks
6 atillery

And next to that:

1x fleet : 3 battleships, 1 destroyer
1x 4 unit mech inf army
2x 4 unit, 3 inf + 1 mech inf army
(and a new army in 1 turn for 4 mech inf's)

This is before drafting!

I know anarres has about 80 tanks and a total of +/- 200 units. He told me he wasn't even sure about attacking me. He will only succeed when he gets enough modern armour ready. That means a massive upgrade! If he has a change of winning the space race he will try that first I think (And keep his army by hand if needed)...

col
12-03-2003, 11:22
I think I'd want a few more artillery too - maybe 50 or so. Great for knocking down that SoD coming your way. Not much by way of air defence there either.

The numbers are deceving though. Your MI will be spread out; his MA will be concentrated in one spot. He will surely hit with about 50 MA at one place. You need to be able to hit him on the way in if you are to stop him.

ProPain
12-03-2003, 12:16
As we discussed on MSN, I would watch out for a nuke attack on your capital. Anarres can prevent you from launching by simply taking your capital. I don't know if a nuke alone would already demolish your space ship but some nukes and some paratroopers will do the trick. I don't know the exact range of paratroopers but Persopolis being only 4 squares from the seaside I suspect it can be reached. If I were Anarres, I'd be looking in that direction instead of impaling myself on your defensive stacks in the chokepoint mountains.

ERIKK
12-03-2003, 15:43
ProPain, you might be right, when the time comes I will build a SDI in Persepolis!

ERIKK
13-03-2003, 22:02
i have put a unit and a border pic on my site!

ERIKK
13-03-2003, 23:26
Turn 256: anarres says he doesn't have ecology yet. We have computers and rocketry and they dont.
Turn 257: we have an average military compared to the Chinese! Three turns to ecology. :D I see our future a lot brighter now. The Chinese did have severe loses to the Ottomans...

col
14-03-2003, 00:48
Can I suggest that you plant some forests along the border too. Slow down any invasion to give you time to respond. Blitzkrieg is your main danger.

ERIKK
17-03-2003, 22:44
some diplo on CFC!

Shabbaman
18-03-2003, 16:37
quote:Originally posted by ERIKK
If I did it no new peacedeal will ever be trusted again (between us).


Hey, there are other people to play with;)

ERIKK
18-03-2003, 20:40
Reseached Fission in turn 273, I am now 3 techs ahead and my military is still averange. I build 4 modern armours per turn.
The techs:
- fission (uranium on map, I got 3 sources)
- synthetic fibers (modern armour, got about 55)
- rocketry (space race)

(I also have 130 mech infantry, 8 attilery, 5 mech inf armies)

Anarres just mass upgraded his infantry (I think) and filling up gaps with cities in former conquered territories. What his plans are I do not know. Domination is out of the question I think and cultural victory is not possible. He will have to attack soon or go for a spaceship himself by sabotaging mine...